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06. Il viandante bevitore (2)

martedì 21 settembre 2010, di roll

[..] Oggi, e non solo simbolicamente, nella Cantina di Angelo Muto è facile intravedere un nuovo sentiero indicato. Una crescita graduale, innanzitutto numerica, quella di questa piccola cantina che continua a conferire parte delle sue uve, e alla sua quarta annata di vino in cui porta la produzione da poco più di duemila bottiglie (una produzione sperimentale iniziata nel 2006) alle 15.000 di oggi. [..]

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36 Messaggi del forum

  • Il viandante bevitore (2) 3 aprile 2012 01:42, di FSjWhWwVCihzm

    Concordo, Arte! L’immagine e8 bruttina, non si puf2 non rcsrnoiceoe. Visible Body rimane, comunque, una grande risorsa.Grazie per essere passata di qui in un giorno in cui in genere ci si dedica ad altro:)A presto e buon w.e.Annarita

  • Il viandante bevitore (2) 4 aprile 2012 04:44, di DwdHWRwYkb

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  • Il viandante bevitore (2) 8 aprile 2012 09:55, di dmsoDDUMcrDCoWilDE

    cdb: I feel that there are a lot of misconceptions and just plain myths out there regarding tubular mtb tires. I’ve done some research into this and I have spoken with a few people that have actually ridden tubular mtb tires in real world conditions and I have spoken with several folks about the carbon rim idea. In fact, I have built up some carbon rimmed mtb wheels, so I have some first hand knowledge of the material for rims in mtb situations. First of all, lets look at the tire issue. One: a good mtb tubular does not exist, but that doesn’t mean it couldn’t. Secondly, if you are afraid of rock cuts, or destroying an expensive tubular mtb tire, please tell me that you don’t run 29″er tubeless set ups, because when you rip your sidewall on that Hutchinson Python, you are walking home, and you are out an expensive tire to boot. (just a single example, I could provide you with more) Removing a damaged or worn tire: If the performance benefits are greater than a tubeless set up, (and everyone that has actually ridden mtb tubulars agrees that it is a better system for high performance), the little extra effort to clean up a rim will not be a consideration. Look at tubeless mtb tires as an example if you don’t believe it. There is no doubt that the tubed set ups are easier, less messy, and more convenient to use, but you don’t see people serious about performance running tubes anymore. According to athletes and the Edge composites people I have spoken with, the benefit to running carbon rims is better ride quality, better durability. and less rotational/overall weight, in that order. Carbon rims are less likely to be damaged in Edge Composites testing. I also found this to be true with the athletes I worked with on the wheels I built up. Stan’s rims can be very light, but a similarly weighted carbon rim would exhibit no flex, whereas a Stan’s rim certainly will exhibit flex. (I am aware of where Stan’s rims are made and that factory isn’t known for making the stiffest aluminum rims in the first place) Is rim stiffness a factor? Certainly. So is the rest of the wheel build, but your final outcome is only as good as the components you choose to build with. Their is no doubt that a stiff, true rim will build a better wheel. Carbon can be controlled and can be made to be just that, in a much more consistent way than metal drawn through a die. Think about it: An aluminum rim extrusion goes through several convolutions before it is a hoop worth making a wheel out of. A carbon rim is molded in it’s final shape. Heck, the Edge Composites rim has it’s spoke holes molded right in them! No drilling required!Okay, so a carbon clincher/tubular may not be for you, but I have no doubt that if the right tread patterns for the tubular are produced that you will see a whole lot of them under racers in the coming years. I have no doubt they can be made to work. I also know that the guys I talked to that have ridden them are salivating at the possibilities. If it is done right, it will be a home run. Of course, that is a pretty big “if” at the moment. We’ll see soon enough.

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  • Il viandante bevitore (2) 9 aprile 2012 10:23, di piEkaOkpg

    Being a long time XC MTB racer, and also Elite CXer. I don’t think that a Tufo casing would be durable enough for MTB use, unless they were to make it significantly more durable than for example, their Flexus tubular cross tire. They are just not very durable to sharp rock cuts. The cost vs. benefit ratio is just not worth it, in my opinion. Yes, it could be a sweet setup on smooth, tacky earth. But, for limited and specific use only. Like a short, groomed multi-lap worldcup type of course where you have mechanical pit stops. For the everyday racer, it’s impractical. But, I guess people ARE willing to waste their money on anything!?!As far as tubular tape goes, opinions vary, but it isn’t really strong enough to counteract the extreme forces placed upon it due to heavy braking, side loads, and especially harsh moisture elements. The popular opinion of top racers and their mechanics agrees with this. Considering that it isn’t currently accepted as the “best” method for attaching CX tires, adding the significantly larger casing size variable of a MTB tire would surely exceed what the base tape and glue is capable of holding. With all the different types of race course terrains, and changing weather, it is important to have many options available to choose from in the days leading up to a race.The expense of these tubular wheels and tires would eliminate the possibility to change out tread patterns at the last minute, due to the multiple day time requirement necessary to do a proper glue job.I’m all for light wheels, but I would say a lighter clincher wheelset w/ a Notubes setup and a few tire choices would be more practical. For example, some of the new 26″ Stan’s race wheelsets that are around 1250g. Surely they could build a 29er rim for less than the 1650ish gram options they currently have.

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  • Il viandante bevitore (2) 21 aprile 2012 10:35, di ougcoWIrzjN

    Even if the new “mtb” version of the tape is wider, it is still susceptible to extreme lateral prying forces that 23c road tubies don’t have to go through. Also, due to the lower pressures of off road use, there is less keeping the tire on the rim, unlike a road tubular w/ much higher pressures (which can actually stay on pretty good w/o glue in an emergency, as opposed to a cx tire).And when it’s time to remove the damaged or worn tire (lucky if you don’t kill that spendy tire in the first 8-10 hours of use), the tape is messier to remove than glue, because it breaks up into little bits. It wants to stick to the tire casing sometimes, and the rim other times. With glue, you can use a light solvent and “smooth” it out, leaving much of it on, and only needing a fresh wet topcoat on the rim.First, to clarify, I have not ridden a carbon mtb rim, nor a mtb tubular. I am hypothesizing based upon my experience racing mtb clinchers and CX tubulars… Take my opinions w/ a grain of salt.What is the huge benefit to using a carbon rim vs. extruded aluminum in MTB? Is it weight? Seen the weight of the Stans rims? Stiffness? Is that stiffness useful? Is stiffness provided to a mtb wheel via rim strength alone, or the quality of spoke build and hub flange width/height? Is carbon any more durable against rock chips and other damage from real world riding? How does that “gain” in stiffness translate into faster riding, when factoring in all the other variables like suspension and the need to swap out tread patterns at moments notice.I will say the carbon rim looks cool. It at least has that going for it. And, if you make it deep enough, you could put some flashy brand stickers on it. Some folks are all over that kind of thing.

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  • Il viandante bevitore (2) 22 aprile 2012 07:39, di mOfTYyoWbpiXakgGY

    To address a few of the issues brought up by cdb – the new Tufo tape is especially for mtb use, with a wider band of tape – not to be confused w/ their traditional tape for cyclocross application. Removal of this tape takes some effort and cleaning as well. Having several seasons of cx both geared and single speed, trail riding on my cross bike and a half a season on a set of mtb tubulars, I have never rolled a tire, not am I worried about it. The tape really works. I agree with his idea that Tufo tires are on the thin side for protecting against sidewall tears, flats, etc… Dugast Rhinos have been my choice, and once again, no issues. Just so you know I am 155lbs, 6′, 1″, ride custom hardtails, steel & ti, and mainly do single speed, but also some elite masters XC and elite cx. VS. Stans rims/ wheels, I would go carbon anyday. Stans rims are OK at best, weights go back and forth as much as a politicians opinions in an election year, and the ride is nowhere the quality of a good carbon rim. Be looking for JHK on a set of carbon 29er wheels w/ Dugast XLs for Bejing if he finds himself on the starting line. If you want the best or what the pros use(Kobollski/ Nys, Frischy, & Swiss Power), then yes, you have to pay to play. I too lean towards clinchers/ tubeless for the tire choices, but make mine carbon for the superior ride quality. Edge 29er carbon wheels will be in around 1350g – 1400g

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  • Il viandante bevitore (2) 29 aprile 2012 07:50, di QDtxJJaSPhpSH

    Interesting article, while I agree with you for the most part I can’t help but wonder how many fewer real wine drinkers we would have without these types of wines. I feel safe in assuming that you have a very advanced palate, or to put it another way, a very mature palate. Was this always the case? My guess would be no. When I look at my own growth as a wine drinker I can’t believe some of the wines I used to think were “good”. The wines that I once thought were good would probably be on the “loathe” list now. But without those wines I probably wouldn’t have advanced my palate to where it is today.I think this all has to do with maturity related to the topic of discussion. Wine, beer, movies, and music all fit. I see examples of this every now and then. I see a movie that I loved 20 years ago, and now when I watch it I can’t believe how bad it is.So while I completely agree with you and have no love for those that choose to make these mass appeal wines, I do see their value to the overall wine community. And even though a majority of the amateur wine drinkers may not take the next step to advance their palate, those that do are in for a lifetime of enjoyment, but owe it, in some ways, to those mass produced “popular” wines.

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  • Il viandante bevitore (2) 5 giugno 2012 16:33, di KRhblMgPfQhIqyui
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  • Il viandante bevitore (2) 6 settembre 2012 23:55, di AHORvUzax
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  • Il viandante bevitore (2) 29 ottobre 2012 08:36, di FEGPAThNZQNznqmL
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  • Il viandante bevitore (2) 21 novembre 2012 00:44, di FXnyqEbNJ
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